hiphop Hip Hop is dead?

[Train]

I dont usually post in the Hip Hop Room as, in recent years, ive lost interest in Hip Hop as a genre. Everything about it, not just the music. However, in recent weeks ive been pulling out all the old Hip Hop tunes and my interest has been given a second run. Right, now theres alot of speak lately about 'hip hop is dead' and such like. Whether or not you agree, you have to say that the genre has had somewhat of a facelift. The goals and aspirations of MCs, post 2000, seem to have changed. The reasons for MCs wanting to pick up a mic, and the standards expected of them as an MC seem to have slipped. This, I feel, has been reflected in the unimaginative, generic and bland lyrics that have been spewed out of MCs mouths. Its reflected in the prentious, dramatised and lackluster beats being tapped out by producers day in day out. But why do you feel Hip Hop has CHOSEN to traverse this path? Do you think its just a natural path every music genre takes and is being played on by artists to make others feel they are 'different'? Or are you of the other school of thought that says that Hip Hop is better now than it was say 10 eyars ago? Why do you think this? What does Hip Hop have now, that it didnt have then?Topic might flop, just wanted to know what modern Hip Hop fans thought of this as I have discussed this COUNTLESS times with backpacking Talib Kweli liking frineds of mine, but they only see one side of the arguement. Just thought id try and get another POV. Particularly looking for opinions from Removal Man and Numeroo. Opinions PLEASE.

[Kurtis]

na its jus asleep

[Removal Man]

Hip Hop aint dead for starters, as long as there's good talent out there its alive, and there isi think the reason we say its dead now is due to a shift in priorities of what Hip Hop was originally aiming towards, you can see a constant progression from the early eighties right up until about 2003my personal opinion is if Hip Hop did die, it died in 2003, why...?well, at the end of 2002 8 Mile hit the cinemas. and if theres one thing i like about that film, its the fact i can make my mum watch it, and at the end, she'll understand exactly what hip hop is about, and how much of an artform it is, thing is, everyone and their mum did watch it, which suddenly acted like hip hops great unveilingthe knock-out punch? 50 f*cking Cent. now i know puffy and that had their time, but IMO 50 Cent was the first BLACK thugged out gangster rapper (shot 9 times) to cross over to the mainstream and become a household name, in doing so, that was the death of raw hip hop your mum hatednow i've kinda thrown these words together pretty quick, but i stand by these points, Eminem followed by 50 Cent was it... where else was it gonna go after that?

[the_one]

Deader than diana

[Train]

Hip Hop aint dead for starters, as long as there's good talent out there its alive, and there isi think the reason we say its dead now is due to a shift in priorities of what Hip Hop was originally aiming towards, you can see a constant progression from the early eighties right up until about 2003my personal opinion is if Hip Hop did die, it died in 2003, why...?well, at the end of 2002 8 Mile hit the cinemas. and if theres one thing i like about that film, its the fact i can make my mum watch it, and at the end, she'll understand exactly what hip hop is about, and how much of an artform it is, thing is, everyone and their mum did watch it, which suddenly acted like hip hops great unveilingthe knock-out punch? 50 f*cking Cent. now i know puffy and that had their time, but IMO 50 Cent was the first BLACK thugged out gangster rapper (shot 9 times) to cross over to the mainstream and become a household name, in doing so, that was the death of raw hip hop your mum hatednow i've kinda thrown these words together pretty quick, but i stand by these points, Eminem followed by 50 Cent was it... where else was it gonna go after that?

See, this is why I wanted your opinion. Thats exactly what I think aswell. Also, theres one major flaw in Hip Hop. It was built on the notion of non conformity. It was a voice for people without a voice. It represented the misrepresented. It had a point to prove and was always anti establishment. I mean, that in itself allows for alot of scope. BUT, what happens when you become the majority. The notion of non conformity cant work as to conform nowadays, is to like Hip Hop, so to not conform, would be to NOT listen to it. Like it or not, theres not alot of misrepresentation of this group of people anymore. Nowadays, it has NO point to prove and it IS the establishment. If you ask me, thats the major flaw. Hip Hop hasnt DIED, per se, it just has nothing left to fight for and nobody willing to fight for it.

[Beavis]

Hip Hop aint dead for starters, as long as there's good talent out there its alive, and there isi think the reason we say its dead now is due to a shift in priorities of what Hip Hop was originally aiming towards, you can see a constant progression from the early eighties right up until about 2003my personal opinion is if Hip Hop did die, it died in 2003, why...?well, at the end of 2002 8 Mile hit the cinemas. and if theres one thing i like about that film, its the fact i can make my mum watch it, and at the end, she'll understand exactly what hip hop is about, and how much of an artform it is, thing is, everyone and their mum did watch it, which suddenly acted like hip hops great unveilingthe knock-out punch? 50 f*cking Cent. now i know puffy and that had their time, but IMO 50 Cent was the first BLACK thugged out gangster rapper (shot 9 times) to cross over to the mainstream and become a household name, in doing so, that was the death of raw hip hop your mum hatednow i've kinda thrown these words together pretty quick, but i stand by these points, Eminem followed by 50 Cent was it... where else was it gonna go after that?

I totally agree with that. Its tragic to think rap will never be the same.

[Numero001]

It got to a point where you had everyone tryna be a punchline rapper, thats when I personally thought it was getting stale. That could have been around 2003 times when everyone was bussin mixtapes. But aside from all of that, I was gonna make a topic the other day on this but I know it would have got air because people think I'm biased against, like I've never liked it, but MCs get too much of the blame, where are the hit producers? When your top producer doesnt even care about your genre then you know something is wrong. When you cant name an upcoming producer or artist then you know theres something wrong. People preferring to listen to old skool Hip Hop or current music from other genre's and its still the old guys getting spoken about constantly, sh*t is bad.There's always gonna be at least a few artists doing some good stuff, so technically it will never be completely dead. Also, Hip Hop culture will never die because thats what they live by, but music as an art form is Tutankahmun. sh*t died when people saw it more as an occupation rather than a way of expression as well as when formula's started ruling whats good music (eg. This producer + this type of song + this feature = hit). sh*t needs to go back to how it was when they were leaders and used imagination, not listening to whats hot and trying to replicate

[Train]

Yea Num, I agree. I wasnt to hear a young bucks take on this. Anyone think Hip Hop is better now than it was then?DURRTY?

[Numero001]

Hip Hop aint dead for starters, as long as there's good talent out there its alive, and there isi think the reason we say its dead now is due to a shift in priorities of what Hip Hop was originally aiming towards, you can see a constant progression from the early eighties right up until about 2003my personal opinion is if Hip Hop did die, it died in 2003, why...?well, at the end of 2002 8 Mile hit the cinemas. and if theres one thing i like about that film, its the fact i can make my mum watch it, and at the end, she'll understand exactly what hip hop is about, and how much of an artform it is, thing is, everyone and their mum did watch it, which suddenly acted like hip hops great unveilingthe knock-out punch? 50 f*cking Cent. now i know puffy and that had their time, but IMO 50 Cent was the first BLACK thugged out gangster rapper (shot 9 times) to cross over to the mainstream and become a household name, in doing so, that was the death of raw hip hop your mum hatednow i've kinda thrown these words together pretty quick, but i stand by these points, Eminem followed by 50 Cent was it... where else was it gonna go after that?

See, this is why I wanted your opinion. Thats exactly what I think aswell. Also, theres one major flaw in Hip Hop. It was built on the notion of non conformity. It was a voice for people without a voice. It represented the misrepresented. It had a point to prove and was always anti establishment. I mean, that in itself allows for alot of scope. BUT, what happens when you become the majority. The notion of non conformity cant work as to conform nowadays, is to like Hip Hop, so to not conform, would be to NOT listen to it. Like it or not, theres not alot of misrepresentation of this group of people anymore. Nowadays, it has NO point to prove and it IS the establishment. If you ask me, thats the major flaw. Hip Hop hasnt DIED, per se, it just has nothing left to fight for and nobody willing to fight for it.

Spot on. Thats what I've been banging on about. Remember when I said about it turned into a pretty boy when it used to be the dude with baggy clothing that didnt co-ordinate, stubble and generally didnt care about its appearance? Mike Kane thought I was talking about gangsta rap alone when he knows I like all aspects.Beats were disjointed. The drums sound like they were at war with the melodies, werent conventional at all neither were the rappers. Now everything merges seemlessly. Nice melodies from trained pianists, drums that fall in line, same with the rappers

[Train]

Exactly. And whatever happened to FREESTYLES. About 1% of artists nowadays can actually FREESTYLE more than like 8 bars. Freestyling is an example of what I think Numero is talking about and the point he was tryna make. Everyone knows that Hip Hop fans seek eclectic perfection now so they are afraid to actually freestyle.

[TF/S4DK]

LMAO for many reasons but to answer the question - hip hop isn't dead.Infact let me put that another way, hip hop is as dead as televison is... Now go figure...

[Removal Man]

LMAO for many reasons but to answer the question - hip hop isn't dead.Infact let me put that another way, hip hop is as dead as televison is... Now go figure...

wow, another cryptic clue from the lord up on high

[Train]

LMAO for many reasons but to answer the question - hip hop isn't dead.Infact let me put that another way, hip hop is as dead as televison is... Now go figure...

wow, another cryptic clue from the lord up on high

LOL, I see the point he was tryna make but his pedantic behaviour is what led to his downfall as the point is illogical and stupid. Probably the reason all he could type to back up or explain the comment was 'Now go figure'

[Removal Man]

LMAO for many reasons but to answer the question - hip hop isn't dead.Infact let me put that another way, hip hop is as dead as televison is... Now go figure...

wow, another cryptic clue from the lord up on high

LOL, I see the point he was tryna make but his pedantic behaviour is what led to his downfall as the point is illogical and stupid. Probably the reason all he could type to back up or explain the comment was 'Now go figure'

his analogy is pants as well

[TF/S4DK]

Lol, not pedantic at all, I'm tired of typing this sh*t out. Look at the game. Look at the industry. JUST f*ckING LOOK.

[Removal Man]

Lol, not pedantic at all, I'm tired of typing this sh*t out. Look at the game. Look at the industry. JUST f*ckING LOOK.

typing what sh*t out?your statements that arent statements at all, but just mere suggestions?strap a pair of balls to wot you write please

[TF/S4DK]

Ahh f*ck it!Hip hop died because it became BIG BUSINESS. Thats the REAL reason you attribute its death to '03. Cos altho hip hop had been leaning to commercial gain since as early as '96, this is the year when it OD and the musical/corporate balance was lost in ALL areas of the entire industry and has just continue to get worse & worse.I compared hip hop to TV, because the thought process involved in television programming, is the same theory being used for hip hop music nowadays...If you used your brain you'd see my analogy was spot on but alas it was wasted... Again I could type on for HOURS even but like I said go figure & I'm tired of typing this same sh*t out in various convo's. It is what it is...

[Train]

LOL you have strapped one ball and half a p*ssy to your arguement, i.e im now very confused. Are you saying its dead or not?Nobody is desperate for your opinion, its just you chatted alot of sh*t in that post so we just needed clarification. 'Alas' we got it. And if you had no intention of typing an opinion, why enter.

[Gillie]

Hip-Hiop Been dead for about Three Years.No One has proudced a Good Hip Hop album Since Get Rich Die Trying.Video Are So sh*t Now.Sells Are So sh*t, Coming Man Back in the day guys sell 1m so eays. People Sell Like Under 200 Thousand In the First week And Just Stop At 700 .

[Removal Man]

Ahh f*ck it!Hip hop died because it became BIG BUSINESS. Thats the REAL reason you attribute its death to '03. Cos altho hip hop had been leaning to commercial gain since as early as '96, this is the year when it OD and the musical/corporate balance was lost in ALL areas of the entire industry.I compared hip hop to TV, because the thought process involved in television programming, is the same theory being used for hip hop music nowadays...If you used your brain you'd see my analogy was spot on but alas it was wasted... Again I could type on for HOURS even but like I said go figure & I'm tired of typing this same sh*t out in various convo's. It is what it is...

see, thats a bit more like iti suppose your analogy works in a unique way, i just wouldnt have used it myself, Hollywood would have been a better example IMO

[TF/S4DK]

LOL you have strapped one ball and half a p*ssy to your arguement, i.e im now very confused. Are you saying its dead or not?Nobody is desperate for your opinion, its just you chatted alot of sh*t in that post so we just needed clarification. 'Alas' we got it. And if you had no intention of typing an opinion, why enter.

Lol. d*ckhead.

[TF/S4DK]

Ahh f*ck it!Hip hop died because it became BIG BUSINESS. Thats the REAL reason you attribute its death to '03. Cos altho hip hop had been leaning to commercial gain since as early as '96, this is the year when it OD and the musical/corporate balance was lost in ALL areas of the entire industry.I compared hip hop to TV, because the thought process involved in television programming, is the same theory being used for hip hop music nowadays...If you used your brain you'd see my analogy was spot on but alas it was wasted... Again I could type on for HOURS even but like I said go figure & I'm tired of typing this same sh*t out in various convo's. It is what it is...

see, thats a bit more like iti suppose your analogy works in a unique way, i just wouldnt have used it myself, Hollywood would have been a better example IMO

Reality television programmes = Ringtone rap albumsReality television programmes dominating TV scheduling = Ringtone rap songs dominating radio scheduling & playlistingReality television stars = new rap starsAre you seeing the trend?

[Numero001]

Ahh f*ck it!Hip hop died because it became BIG BUSINESS. Thats the REAL reason you attribute its death to '03. Cos altho hip hop had been leaning to commercial gain since as early as '96, this is the year when it OD and the musical/corporate balance was lost in ALL areas of the entire industry.I compared hip hop to TV, because the thought process involved in television programming, is the same theory being used for hip hop music nowadays...If you used your brain you'd see my analogy was spot on but alas it was wasted... Again I could type on for HOURS even but like I said go figure & I'm tired of typing this same sh*t out in various convo's. It is what it is...

see, thats a bit more like iti suppose your analogy works in a unique way, i just wouldnt have used it myself, Hollywood would have been a better example IMO

Reality television programmes = Ringtone rap albumsReality television programmes dominating TV scheduling = Ringtone rap songs dominating radio scheduling & playlistingReality television stars = new rap starsAre you seeing the trend?

Yeah I got you from the beginning but llow the riddles, just come and say it.Your exactly right tho, HH is processed and thats exactly what it wasnt and stood against in the beginning as Jamal said

[Train]

The best group EVER created in hip hop said it the best, 'CAN IT BE WHEN IT WAS ALL SO SIMPLE?'

[TF/S4DK]

Yeah I got you from the beginning but llow the riddles, just come and say it.

LMAO for many reasons but to answer the question - hip hop isn't dead. Infact let me put that another way, hip hop is as dead as televison is... Now go figure...